Lycoming Fuel Injector placement

Discussion in 'Firewall Forward & Fuel System' started by EAABipe40FF, Jun 1, 2018.

Help Support Biplane Forum by donating using the link above.
  1. Jun 1, 2018 #1

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    Registered Users Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    5,034
    Likes Received:
    945
    I'm in the process of installing the HIO360A1A on the Acroduster 2 and have several issues. First is the placement of the fuel injectors into the cylinders. There is a hole(plugged if not used) on both the top and bottom of the intake side of the cylinder. On the IO320 the injectors go into the top of the cylinders. I find that the injectors on the HIO360 are on the bottom which causes problems. Not only will they have to go through the baffles but they are quite long and since the cowling is REALLY going to be tight with the wider engine, it will be difficult if not impossible to fit them in....

    So the question is, can I put the injectors in the top rather in the bottom? Does it make a difference?

    I'll take pictures today.

    Thanks,

    Jack
     
  2. Jun 1, 2018 #2

    TFF1

    TFF1

    TFF1

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2010
    Messages:
    3,241
    Likes Received:
    598
    You can put them on top. That is normally where they are. Turbo Lances have them on the bottom but that is a strange engine. I am always amazed how many combos Lycoming has. Most don't do anything special but to say "mine".
     
  3. Jun 1, 2018 #3

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    Registered Users Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    5,034
    Likes Received:
    945
    GEDC4542.JPG GEDC4541.JPG View attachment 41632 View attachment 41632 Thanks. Now I have to figure out what lines to use. Probably try to use them off the IO320 but may not be long enough. The lines on thew engine now are very long, don't even have a stock look. Here are pictures as soon as I find them.
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2018
  4. Jun 2, 2018 #4

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    Registered Users Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    5,034
    Likes Received:
    945
    I have to admit I do NOT understand how this FI works. How does the flow divider work.....how are the cylinders indexed......?

    I'm going to have to be very careful replacing or swapping the lines off the IO320'

    I have another problem with the linkage which is different...new thread.
     
  5. Jun 2, 2018 #5

    taff

    taff

    taff

    Senior Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2007
    Messages:
    3,496
    Likes Received:
    870
    Location:
    Atlanta GA
    So I purchased a fuel injector system.
    Then I find out that my cylinders only have tapped plugged threads at the bottom ( I guess for a primer line)

    I am in the process of replacing my cylinders. It :mad: me off no end.
    Slowly getting over it and it's going to add another 6 months to the build. But who cares, it's only part of life.
     
  6. Jun 2, 2018 #6

    PittsDriver68

    PittsDriver68

    PittsDriver68

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2013
    Messages:
    4,086
    Likes Received:
    1,124
    The Bendix RSA fuel injection system is a continuous flow system. Do a Google search and you can find the docs that describe its operation and maintenance. Essentially the flow divider is just a splitter, although I recall that it has a spring diaphram in it so that variations in flow are evened out. The fuel control down on the sump has mechanically balanced diaphragms inside that balance the input from the mixture control, throttle control, and incoming air pressure to control the flow of fuel to the flow divider. Fuel inlet pressure to the fuel control should be something like 25 psi. "Upper deck" fuel pressure at the flow divider will be between 3psi and 15psi in normal operation. Those stainless tubes that carry fuel from the flow dividers to the injector bodies are expensive. Don't just throw them away. The fuel injector bodies on a normally aspirated engine have an internal nozzle and a screen around the lower body that lets air in so that the nozzle has the desired spray pattern for good atomization. We will leave the tricks involved with using turbo engine injector bodies on a normally aspirated engine to another day.

    Hope this explanation helps,

    Wes
     
  7. Jun 2, 2018 #7

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    Registered Users Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    5,034
    Likes Received:
    945
    At least I have holes both top and bottom, and yes I believe the same hole can be used for the primer.
     
  8. Jun 2, 2018 #8

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    Registered Users Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    5,034
    Likes Received:
    945
    Yes Wes it helps and I'll do more research.

    Yes I know the lines are expensive and damage prone . I've read the AD by which the lines on the new engine are problematic. (That chain was carefully placed and removed and didn't touch the line) Those lines look to me like extra long lines are available and bent/installed by "bubba"(who is a friend of mine).

    Thanks,

    Jack
     
  9. Jun 2, 2018 #9

    biplanebob

    biplanebob

    biplanebob

    Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2006
    Messages:
    932
    Likes Received:
    391
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    KLNS
    Jack,
    Lycoming Service Instruction SI 1301B "Identification of primer and Fuel Injection Lines" lists part numbers and lengths.
    Lycoming Service Bulletin MSB 342F shows the correct installation layout and hardware.

    I purchased FAA-PMA lines from Aero-Instock.

    Bob
     
    ernstfokker likes this.
  10. Jun 2, 2018 #10

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    Registered Users Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    5,034
    Likes Received:
    945
    Thanks Bob. I recall seeing one of those SB or Sl.
     
  11. Jun 2, 2018 #11

    hosspowerinc

    hosspowerinc

    hosspowerinc

    Member

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2010
    Messages:
    379
    Likes Received:
    36
    Location:
    Andrews NC
    I believe airflow performance sells experimental injector lines at a reasonable price. They also offer an experimental specific overhaul on bendix fi for about half what a certified system would cost.
     
    ernstfokker likes this.
  12. Jun 2, 2018 #12

    TFF1

    TFF1

    TFF1

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2010
    Messages:
    3,241
    Likes Received:
    598
    Things to remember is the injectors are calibrated. Don't mix injector parts. The AD was written because no one was noticing when rotten adel clamps rubbed a hole in a fuel line until they put out the fire. Procedural AD to keep it on the A&Ps mind. The flow divider splits the one fuel line from the servo into the number of cylinders and acts as an anti siphon valve when you shut off the engine. Keeps the lines dripping once all is shut down. As for working, it is similar to a Fuelie Vette from the 50s and 60s.
     
  13. Jun 2, 2018 #13

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    Registered Users Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    5,034
    Likes Received:
    945
    Are the lines specifically indexed off the divider, can only be put in the proper place like 1, 3, 4, 2....?
     
  14. Jun 2, 2018 #14

    airplanegeek

    airplanegeek

    airplanegeek

    Supporting Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2016
    Messages:
    584
    Likes Received:
    202
    Indexing doesn’t matter
     
  15. Jun 2, 2018 #15

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    Registered Users Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    5,034
    Likes Received:
    945
    Thanks Kendall, that's what I was gleaning but no where did anything simply say it.
     
  16. Jun 2, 2018 #16

    Biggie Rat

    Biggie Rat

    Biggie Rat

    New Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2012
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    I had the same problem after a PS5 gave it up on my Hyper-Bipe and I changed to injection and only had primer ports. I made the mistake of using Continental injector lines. After i cut and fitted them a IA friend ask where the lines came from and was told that Continental lines are of a different ID than those Lycoming uses. I guess that Continental use length and ID to meter flow. Sure wasted a lot of time.
     
  17. Jun 2, 2018 #17

    Cameron

    Cameron

    Cameron

    Supporting Member Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2007
    Messages:
    2,332
    Likes Received:
    683
    Jack,
    I’ve got the RSA install, troubleshooting, operation, etc manuals in pdf. Pm me your email address if you want them.
     
  18. Sep 14, 2018 #18

    garyg

    garyg

    garyg

    Well-Known Member Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2011
    Messages:
    632
    Likes Received:
    99
    So if you move the injectors from bottom from to top, how much luck is there in removing the plugs without harm to the plugs. I have tried to remove them in the past and I found them to be very resistant with a brass plug that wants to round out the allen head.
     
  19. Sep 14, 2018 #19

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    EAABipe40FF

    Registered Users Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2009
    Messages:
    5,034
    Likes Received:
    945
    I wanted to move to another position on the spider and the brass plug was resistant so I ordered another injector line to re-route. Yes, very tight..... I consider using a little heat and decided against it.

    Right now I'm rebuilding the engine so bigger fish to fry. My camera broke I hope I remember the routing(not really a problem as I copied routing from the manual and have it marked, thanks to Cameron)

    Jack
     

Share This Page